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 Post subject: Yao priest dress
PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:41 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
Hello,
I'm looking for informations on Yao priest dresses and pictures of some.
I saw a couple of pics on the Tribaltrappings.com website and also one on this forum. Would you have anymore to show me ?
Is this ethnic group also well established in Vietnam ?
Could you tell me more about these dresses ? Are they difficult to come by ?
Thanks for your help
Nicolas


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 8:44 pm 
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Location: Canterbury, UK
Vietnam - yes, where they are often referred to as Dao amongst other names. See http://www.tribaltextiles.info/Gallerie ... nority.htm and http://www.tribaltextiles.info/Gallerie ... _Trang.htm

A very good reference book is by your compatriot, Jess G Pourret 'The Yao: The Mien and Mun Yao in China, Vietnam, Laos and Thailand' published by River Books Co., Ltd, distributed outside Thailand and USA by Thames & Hudson 2002. ISBN 974-8225-52-6 Chapter 6 covers 'Religious Items and Ceremonial Paintings'.

Another book re Yao in Vietnam is "A Yao Community in Sapa, Vietnam" see http://www.tribaltextiles.info/communit ... c.php?t=78

"Peoples of the Golden Triangle, Six Tribes in Thailand" by Paul and Elaine Lewis published by Thames and Hudson 1984 ISBN 0-500-97314-8 includes the Mien as the Yao of often referred to outside China. This also has a section on religion with some priest's clothing and religious paintings but much less than the Pourret book.

Yes, I have seen Yao priests robes around to buy but usually they are pretty expensive.

Although I have quite a few Yao textiles I don't have any priest's clothing to share with you although I do have some prayer weavings.

Best,

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Pamela

http://www.tribaltextiles.info
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 Post subject: yao chamane robes
PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:18 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 11:52 am
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Location: france
Bonjour à tous

Here are the pictures of two exemples of yao taoist priest or chaman robes from Viêt Nam

Those robes are worn a lot. The priests used to roll on the ground during cermonies. The silk embroideries are fragile. On the front on the robes we can see more wear at the belt place as the rubing of the belt wear out rapidly the embroidered motifs. The second robe shows important replacements of fabric and embroideries and looks like to be made of parts of several old robes sewn together.

The symbolism of those designs is linked to the taoist pantheon. There is an interesting paper on those ritual clothes in an issue of HALI. I 'll try to find the reference of the article.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:13 pm 
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
Merci Louis for these informative pictures.
Since then i found two dresses, but i'm not good at photography.
So here are the 'bad' pictures.


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File comment: First dress front
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:24 pm 
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
The second dress, longer than the first and of a much better quality. Some inscriptions embroidered in Chinese on the front helped me to understand that it was dated after the rise of the democratic republic in Vietnam and obviously coming from this country. But I can't understand which year (for the time on)


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File comment: Second dress front
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 Post subject: Yao priest dress
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:28 pm 
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
Yao priest dress #2


Attachments:
File comment: Detail of the date in Chinese on the front.
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File comment: Second dress detail back
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 4:21 pm 
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
For the ones that are interested, my wife and I were able to translate the date in Chinese caracters embroidered on the front right side of the dress.
It is written :

'Democratic Republic of Vietnam, year sui ci jia chen, 11th month, 15th day'
(yue nan min zhu gong he sui ci jia chen nian shi yi yue shi wu ri)

The calendar used here is obviously the Chinese Republican calendar, and, from what we found, 1904 was a sui ci jia chen year. So we have to add a whole Chinese cycle of 60 years, and we obtain as a result the date of 1964.
Conclusion : this Yao priest dress was dedicated in 1964, in Vietnam.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 5:25 pm 
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Nicolas

Stunning textiles! Thanks so much for sharing them with us. I love the detective work. They have such character and 'presence'. I feel that the shamen who wore them must have been powerful and had a strong effect on their fellows. They are certainly fine pieces, especially the second. In the photos the 'characters' fairly leap off the surface of the cloth. Certainly the finest I have seen and I can well imagine why you have been so very struck by them.

I wish you all the best with your negotiations!

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Pamela

http://www.tribaltextiles.info
on-line tribal textiles resource


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 Post subject: hali reference
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 8:56 pm 
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Bonsoir à tous

I have consulted my HALI index and found the article about those robes.

The article is from Wilmorat Jenjarassakul, Vichai Chinalai and Lee J. Chinalai. It is in Hali issue # 109, pages 94 to 99, with 6 robes illustrated.

If somebody wants a copy of this paper I can PDF it and send to whom wants it, just send me an email.

Cordialement

Louis


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 23, 2008 10:01 pm 
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As we have permission to post images from Jess Pourret's book on the Yao (details with image) I thought I would post some pics of a priest's robe quite similar to the ones you have posted. Sorry about the quality of the photo on the left but it is near the spine of the book:
Quote:
"550 A-B A Kim Meun priest wearing his costume comprising the Fam Tsing crown (of cloth and reinforced hard paper) and dragon robe in indigo cotton embroidered with silk. The latter is very close to the Kim Mun robe in design. The front flaps show the dragon and the Messengers, while the back has a multitude of gods and saints, the Three Pures Ones, Buddhist symbols, trigrams representing the five elements, etc. A similar dragon robe is used by other Taoist ethnic groups such as the Zhuang, Nung, T'ai, etc. A Shi Gong priest deals with healing and exorcism."


Attachments:
File comment: A Kim Meun priest page 201 Figs 550 A-B from 'The Yao: The Mien and Mun Yao in China, Vietnam, Laos and Thailand by Jess G Pourret published by River Books
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Pamela

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 Post subject: Thanks
PostPosted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 12:06 pm 
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
Thanks Pamela for these pictures from the Pourret's book.
I just ordered this book and the other one that, with Susan, you advised me to buy.
The similarity between the dress showed in the book and the one i pictured is striking. Very interesting.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:18 pm 
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Martin Conlan was keen for me add to this thread a very striking Kim Mun Lantien drawn/painted priest's or shaman's robe which he was very fortunate to find in S W China on his recent trip. There it was, standing out in its paleness sitting on a pile of vibrantly coloured textiles... For Martin this was probably his most exciting find and he was keen to share it with us last Sunday at the tribal fair at the Hilton, Olympia.

It was suggested to Martin that this robe was made for the initiation of a new priest/shaman and would only be used one or twice. Martin believes the gown to be from Laos, originally acquired at the Laos/Vietnam border. Jess Pourret on page 200 of his book on the Yao cited several times above, shows a somewhat similar drawn/painted robe from the Jinping area, Yunnan, which he felt "reflects harder economic times. Probably made by a Chinese painter in the 1990s."

In the case of the robe that Martin found we feel that it is probably an older robe. The fabric is hand spun and hand woven with the selvedge edges clearly visible inside along the horizontal joins. The painted surface is smoother and lighter than the reverse. I assume that the top surface was probably beaten and perhaps bleached to give a smooth surface for the painting and to make the images stand out. It still has three sets of twisted (or plaited - I don't have it with me to check) ties down the front opening.

Am I correct in thinking that the robe has both dragons and qilin (judging from the hooves). I would welcome comments/information on the various illustrations and signs. (I have to confess to being very strong at the fair looking, photographing and enjoying it. However, overnight, the lively and graphic images were very strong in my mind and I weakened next morning and contacted Martin to ask him to hold it for me! Such is the slippery slope of this textile virus!)


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Pamela

http://www.tribaltextiles.info
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Last edited by Pamela on Wed Nov 12, 2008 7:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:21 pm 
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images of the back...


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File comment: back
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File comment: detail of dragon from the back
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File comment: two qilin from the back?
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File comment: detail from the back
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Pamela

http://www.tribaltextiles.info
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:25 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:41 pm
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Location: Formerly Taipei -Taiwan, now Shanghai - China
For what I know :
日means 'day'/'sun'
月 means 'moon'
日天王 means 'celestial king'
臣 Chinese pronunciation is 'chen', but I don't see the meaning in this circumstance. It must have a taoist meaning.
If it can help...
PS One interesting thing, I think, is the symmetry of the inscriptions and their opposition (sun versus moon) making the whole thing looks like the classical ying-yang opposition. Typically Taoist and esoteric.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 14, 2008 6:20 am 
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臣 can have several meanings - a courtier or a subject. Is it possible that this 臣 employed so many times on this garment actually has both meanings intended for the individual wearing it in terms of his role as intercessor/priest a servant and courtier to the gods and people at the same time?


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